We had a conversation with Luiz Maia of MAIA IP, an experienced international property specialist in the Brazilian and Portuguese markets predominantly Maia on the Golden Quarter Show.
Some of the key takeaways from our conversation with Luiz were:
- Things to watch out for when investing in Portuguese real estate or the golden visa program
- The unique but distinct lure of Comporta, Madeira and the Azores
- Funds, funds, funds – as the next big thing in the Portuguese golden visa landscape
- The soaring Western demand for Portugal
We discuss which areas in Portugal give the best ROI for real estate investors, we talk Portuguese funds and discuss what lies ahead for the Portuguese golden visa.
MAIA International – real estate experts
Lorena Jimenez: For the benefit of our audience if you could give us some insight on MAIA International and what led you to set it up?
Luiz Maia: I set up Maia INT in Brazil in 2013 when I saw the opportunity for Brazilians to invest especially in the USA markets, especially Miami and Orlando. Portugal has way better programs/incentives such as 0% inheritance tax, low condominium fees and superior quality of life with very affordable cost of living so I saw the opportunity to bring the business to Portugal from the Brazilians.
Lorena Jimenez: Was it a key incentive for you, because you yourself are Brazilian?
Luiz Maia: Yes, well the Brazilians have always had a good connection with Portugal of every 3 Brazilians one has a Portuguese surname, so we’ve always had a big connection. In fact, its quite funny we used to say that Portugal discovered Brazil, that’s history but Brazilians discovered Portugal recently. Portugal has changed so much in the last 8 years that it became extremely interesting for Brazilians to live here. The number one connection of course is the language.
We used to have this joke in Brazil that Portugal would be great if it was in Europe, because we always thought Portugal was so different to the rest of Europe but things have changed so much, in Lisbon and Porto they have become such cosmopolitan cities and you can basically connect to the whole world.
Going back to your question, I think Brazilians have always had a connection with Portugal but it wasn’t as strong for many years but it’s become more evident in the past 5,6 years or maybe 8 years that people were really looking for Portugal as a great place for a good quality of life.
Lorena Jimenez: Since you set up MAIA in 2013 what do you feel has been the biggest hurdle?
Luiz Maia: In the beginning when I was working with other companies, I felt that the quality of servicing that Brazilians were getting in New York and other places in the US was great and I felt that the backbone of client servicing in Portugal was in demand.
We did a very good job in Brazil; our company was always quite famous for that and I think bringing the same concept to Portugal was the biggest hurdle because it’s a different culture and a different way of doing business, at the same time the country was becoming very cosmopolitan so I felt Portugal had the need to adapt to world-class services. Not that the Portuguese were doing it wrong, but to accept this overwhelming boom we needed to bring our (service) standards here.
That was probably the biggest hurdle.
So, we decided to go with the one-stop shop concept. For us that is the best way for our investors and clients to make solid and peace of mind foreign investments.
Lorena Jimenez: So perhaps elaborate a bit more on that what do you mean by setting up a one-stop shop for your clients.
Luiz Maia: What we did is when we have our clients, we give them the full service. They come to us and we have the best law firms working with us, that can give them the best tax lawyers if you want to move to Portugal.
For the golden visa program, which is probably one of the most popular golden visa programmes in the world, we have the best advisers for that, construction companies, developers, we would basically centralize all the information in our office and we make sure that the client is satisfied so that they don’t have to go to twenty people to get a deal done its all centralized through us, we have seen that this has made a big difference.
We were talking to a Singapore client, who was super scared about the language barrier. I said to him we will centralize everything in English and Portuguese and that gave him peace of mind, and he understood that we’ll do what’s best for the client not just what is best for the service provider.
Lorena Jimenez: What would you say is the differentiating factor of MAIA?
Luiz Maia: We get things done with quality we have really high service standards.
For background, I’ve worked managing advertising accounts like UBS Australia from an agency side and the kind of standards when you work with these kinds of clients –
You can’t be anything less than great and that is a pillar in my company. We have to be great all the time.
We don’t have clients that we didn’t manage or didn’t meet their expectations, we work tirelessly for that reason. I think for the next 50 years in this business word of mouth is the most important thing and we feel that we don’t have any bad reviews in that regard. For us, we get this done with quality.
Read more: Portugal’s Golden Visa: A Progress Report
Portugal’s Golden Visa in a state of flux
Lorena Jimenez: The rules are changing in Portugal 2022 will be a different landscape for the Portugal Golden Visa, what lies ahead, what trends are you seeing and what’s coming up in the future?
Luiz Maia: The program has been a real success with more than 9.500 residency permits issued since 2012. I think that from 2022 we are moving from Lisbon and Porto and the focus will definitely be on private equity funds (changing from 350- 500K).
I personally found it difficult in the past 6 years, like most people in the golden visa business, as I had almost no interest in country areas. It’s different, people are looking for passport of course and maybe a base in Portugal and when you are talking about a country house or a quinta which is a little farm we are talking about maintenance and it becomes a bit of a problem.
People don’t want headaches when they are away, they want something easy to go on the rental market and eventually when they move here, they also have liquidity to sell it.
We think private equity funds are a good solution because there is no maintenance, it ticks the box with the golden visa and it becomes more and more popular because the complexity is not so big and it has become really quite well accepted by the government.
I can see the Azores and Madeira is growing for the USA market, we are getting more enquiries especially in the Azores.
The difficulty there is that there is not so much stock available but as the Azores has a 4.5 hour direct connection to the US, we are getting a lot of interest. Investors can use it as a second home not just for their golden visa. We see that the investors from the US market are actually spending more and more time in Portugal.
American HNWIs demand for Portugal
Lorena Jimenez: Since when have you noticed a trend in the growing demand from the US market?
Luiz Maia: I think in the last one and a half years not just because of the elections last year but since March of last year, with how the pandemic was being handled in the US plus elections which always create a bit of tension, so when we had the elections, demand grew a lot.
Not that I’m saying that Trump supporters are coming here, it’s not that, it’s just that the country is divided and there is a bit of uncertainty from both sides, people are just looking for a plan-B.
It reminds me a bit of Hong Kong in May 2019 where we had this wave of demand and applications because it’s not that people really wanted to leave Hong Kong, they just wanted to have a plan B. I feel that the US look at Portugal as a good option because it’s the entry gate for Europe. The US is going strong, 30% of the leads on my website are coming in from the US.
Lorena Jimenez: In terms of areas in Portugal – which do you feel are giving the greatest return to investors in the long run?
Luiz Maia: I still think Lisbon and Comporta area are very good options. The cities are small and 90% of the construction is full rehabilitation which means you’ll have a building with 10 apartments which you’ll basically keep the façade and make 10 new apartments, you’re not making many more apartments. So it’s basically the same number of apartments, the city is just getting renovated. You’re very close to the coast, most places in Lisbon are a 15–20-minute drive to the beach.
Even with the pandemic I know that there are many people looking for places outside, especially in the Comporta area, which I find one of the most attractive places outside of Lisbon and Porto in Portugal, probably the number one.
Comporta is basically becoming one of the trendiest places in the world. Its on the longest coast of Europe, has sandy beaches, an hour and ten minutes from the airport and it’s become the new St Tropez or Hamptons of Portugal. I find that especially the French, British and Belgians love it, you see a lot of demand from these countries as well as Holland. In Comporta and Alentejo all the big names in fashion and architecture are building incredible things over there.
Portuguese real estate
Lorena Jimenez: Portugal’s golden visa is one of the most popular investment migration programmes in the world – but in your opinion do you feel that this surge in demand has created a ‘bubble’ in terms of the real estate market in Portugal?
Luiz Maia: In 2017/18 I would definitely say that; however, the prices in Portugal have soared in the last year or so but not as fast as they used to. We still see apartments in Portugal in prime areas that people are paying the same prices as in Paris but they are trophy apartments, everywhere in the world you will always have that. Properties that you will pay a ridiculous amount of money because it is unique, in every city in the world you’ll find that.
Due to the pandemic, we have noticed a lot of interest for houses outside of the city centers; however, this was a global trend.
The Portuguese market is dynamic and the prices are still competitive.
When we see a property for sale for EUR 17,000 per sqm I wouldn’t consider this as a reference but a “trophy” property like we have in any cosmopolitan city in the world. We get this comparison a lot, I get clients from New York that say “I can buy something in Manhattan for that price”. So yes, but its not the same location, not the same facilities and not the same view. I think its competitive, I don’t see any market crash.
We always watch out for one thing, when you have properties for golden visas that are a one-bedroom apartment for 50 sq.m and no views and you’re paying EUR 10,000 per sqm, yes, I don’t think it’s a very good investment. But you can find EUR 10,000 per sqm, with views for two-bedroom apartments in other areas. You just need to watch out.
There are people who bought buildings to be renovated five years ago and those that bought last year. Those that bought last year may have more difficulty to make more profit than those that bought five years ago.
Challenges faced in the pandemic
Lorena Jimenez: We all had a tricky 2020, perhaps tell me more about your experience in the last 12 months and any challenges you might have had serving your clients during the pandemic.
Luiz Maia: Interesting question. Last year for us was a very good year.
In 2013 we arrived and were doing a deal here and there but last year went very well what really helped us was that luxury real estate market went over the roof as quality of life became really important, the average price of acquisition become much higher (35%~).
Also, the world became so digital.
Portugal needed to become more digital from every single angle, from connecting electricity and from all the kind of services that a lot of other countries were already ahead. In a way the pandemic has helped Portugal become more digital.
We invested in virtual tours and webinars and all this information that we could use with our phones and cameras so it wasn’t bad. It was a good year for the market. We didn’t just survive, everybody did very well, especially with technology it was a good year.
Also travel restrictions meant people couldn’t travel so there was a fear of missing out on the golden visa. There were two or three announcements that the Portuguese golden visa was going to be cancelled and we only had the decree law by the end of the year.
There were so many things happening for example in Brazil, banks weren’t giving good interest rates so they started investing in properties all over the world because the interest they had on their savings in banks was so low. Portugal has always offered the option of buying a property and getting a golden visa.
So now there is a surge in demand as people don’t know when will the next pandemic come? We don’t know.
But if you have a Portuguese golden visa, you could be in Europe and not be stuck in Brazil or another country, so I think this is something that people are really considering and the real estate market is doing very well.
Lorena Jimenez: Well this pandemic has certainly driven the message home that everyone should be giving to having a plan B and second citizenship or investing in a golden visa now.
Luiz Maia: I think citizenship is now top of the news in most places, it’s incredible. It became more important.
No one ever thought it was so important to have two passports, its not just about the diplomatic situation but also about where you can be when things like this (pandemic) happen.
To give you an example I have an Australian passport so for me to move from Portugal to Australia it couldn’t really work because my wife doesn’t have an Australian passport. But if I didn’t have a family, it would be the best place to be right now, as there is no covid there anymore. A lot of people are thinking how important it is to have a second citizenship, when you can work from home, you could be anywhere, but you need a passport. This is one of the beauties of the citizenship programmes.
Lorena Jimenez: Thank you, Luiz, for giving us all your insight on the Portuguese golden visa and real estate investment throughout Portugal and the trends you’ve been noticing.
I think it’s been a very interesting conversation so thank you for joining in. So before we wrap up where would our audience be able to find you in the online space.
Luiz Maia: We are located in Lisbon but the best way to get in touch is www.maiaip.com and my email is mailto:info@maiaip.com. We would be happy to assist with any queries or enquiries. Thank you so much.
